【新唐人2009年1月17日訊】【细语人生】（259）天外有天(下集)-記武術大師李有甫先生的人生傳奇。
宇新：观众朋友，大家好。今天节目继续为您请到的还是武术与气功、中医界的知名人物名人物李有甫先生。在上一集節目呢主要談到了李有甫先生他是如何開始習武以及後來呢是如何在他的兩位名師陳盛甫和陳濟生老師的指導之下成為中國響當噹的大師級人物的。今天我們就談李有甫先生的人生另外的一個部分。
Yu Xin: Dear viewers, today we will continue our interview with Mr. Li Youfu,
the renowned martial arts and Qigong master, and a Chinese medicine expert.
During our last program, we spoke about how Mr. Li learned martial arts
and how he became a martial arts master with the guidance of Masters Chen
Shengfu and Chen Jisheng. Today, we will explore other phases of Mr. Liós
life.
男音旁白：如果說一個人由於天生的素質再加上後天的勤奮和機遇能成為一名武林
高手，可能還不稀奇。但如果一個人既是武術大師又擁有特異功能和高超的醫術，
為人解除痛苦，治病救人，那就令人稱奇了。
Narrator: It may not come as a surprise that relying on oneós innate quality
and hard work, given the opportunity, a person can become a martial arts
master. However if a person not only is a martial arts master, but also
possesses supernormal abilities and superb medical skills that allow one
to cure illnesses, it would truly be amazing.
宇新：李有甫先生您好。在上一集節目我們談到了以上我們介紹的那個部分。另外
呢您是如何成為氣功領域的碩士的？這是在什麼時候的事情？
Yu Xin: Hello Mr. Li Youfu. We just gave a short overview of what we discussed
during our last interview. Now, we look at other facets of your life. How
did you obtain a Masters degree in Qigong? When did this happen?
李有甫：這是從文化革命以後啊，1977年開始恢復高考。因為文革當中大家失去了
學習的機會，十幾年我真是讀書的年齡。儘管我自學了很多的東西，比如中醫啊，
什麼古典的文學啊等等這些東西，但是我想我要真正系統地學習，還得自己努力。
我這個念頭產生以後，我就把大學體育學院體育系本科的他們那些所有的課程拿來，
我就開始自學。
Li Youfu: After the Cultural Revolution, college entrance examinations were
restored in 1977. Chinese people had lost the opportunity to attain higher-level
education during the Cultural Revolution for over 10 years. That time I
was at a school age. Though I learned many things on my own, such as traditional
Chinese medicine and
宇新：好厲害啊。
Yu Xin: Amazing!
李有甫：因為這是很艱苦的一個過程。晝夜不捨地苦讀。三年之後呢，我考上了這
個山西大學體育系武術教授陳盛甫老先生，也就是我的老師，考上了他的這個武術
研究生。
Li Youfu: To study on ones own is a difficult process. I studied hard day
and night. After three years, I was granted admission into the Shanxi University
graduate program of martial arts, taught by martial arts professor Chen
Shengfu.
宇新：哇，那時候您的老師是在那裡邊任教了。
Yu Xin: Wow, your teacher was teaching there at that time.
李有甫：他是系主任，又恢復了教授的職務。我是81年考上的他的武術碩士。82年
呢，有一次全國民族體育運動會，在內蒙古呼和浩特召開傳統武術的表演。我在那
次大會上呢也奪得了武術冠軍，就是用陳老師教我的舞這個鞭桿。
Li Youfu: He was the head of the department, and had his professor title
restored by that time. I was admitted in 1981 into the martial arts graduate
program. In 82, a national sports competition was held in Hohhot of Inner
Mongolia. There was a demonstration of classical martial arts and associated
with it a contest. I won the martial arts championship using the whip rod
that Master Chen had taught me.
宇新：以上講的都是您在習武過程中您是怎麼樣的苦學、自學，而且後來又考上了
這個武術碩士。那您什麼時候開始從事中醫的呢？您在洛杉磯有自己的診所，而且
還是大學的這個教授。
Yu Xin: You have told us that you studied hard on your own to achieve competency
in martial arts, and later you were admitted into the martial arts Masters
Degree program. Then, when did you change discipline and study traditional
Chinese medicine? We understand that you own a clinic in Los Angeles, and
you are a university professor.
李有甫：是，我在洛杉磯有一個診所，我自己給人家看病，有加州執照。我還有一
個草藥中心，就是用中藥提純。
Li Youfu: Yes, I have a clinic in Los Angeles. I treat patients and I was
granted a California license. I also am owner of an herb center, which allows
me to remove impurities of traditional Chinese medicine that had developed
over the centuries.
宇新：您研製的？
Yu Xin: You developed it?
李有甫：研製的，在美國生產的一些個成方，中藥、草藥的成方。我有這樣一個公
司。我自己做老闆吧。
Li Youfu: I developed the system that allows us to produce Chinese medicine
and herb prescriptions. I am the owner of such a company and am responsible
for all aspects in that firm.
宇新：您什麼時候開始學習中醫的？
Yu Xin: When did you begin learning traditional Chinese medicine?
李有甫：我學中醫，其實最早還是自學。跟我上武術碩士是一樣的。
Li Youfu: At first, I learned traditional Chinese medicine through self-study,
just like I was able to enter the martial arts Masters Degree program without
having taken lower level classes.
宇新：跟您這個武術有聯繫嗎？
Yu Xin: Does it have any connection with martial arts?
李有甫：有聯繫。由於練武術嗎，小孩嗎就好奇，想學點穴，我就讀這個中醫針灸
的書，把那穴位全背下來。背下之後，那才20來歲啊，我發現說這是治病的，當時
就開始找中醫的老師啊，跟他們學些扎針的技術。當時那個文革當中，也比較亂。
就是有了病，也很少有醫生給你看，沒有什麼負責任的，當時慢慢我扎針技術還不
錯，有些同學他們病了就找我來，我就給他們扎針。
Li Youfu: Yes, martial arts and traditional Chinese medicine are linked.
Because I practiced martial arts in my youth, I became curious and wanted
to know about Point Press. I read books on acupuncture, and memorized all
the acupuncture points. When I was in my twenties, I became aware that acupuncture
was for curing illnesses, so I began to look for traditional Chinese medicine
teachers to learn acupuncture. That was during the Cultural Revolution, everything
was chaotic. Even if you fell ill, doctors would rarely treat you. There
was hardly anyone who felt responsible for society. I gradually became more
learned in the acupuncture healing method. Some students would come to me
when they became ill, and I would treat them with acupuncture.
宇新：就好使？
Yu Xin: It was effective?
李有甫：很有效。我讀武術研究生的時候呢，也學了這個中醫一些個課程，中醫的
經絡學，還有腦電圖，和用經絡測試的方法，來做論文的研究。所以我也走向中醫
這方面。
Li Youfu: Yes, it was very effective. When I studied for the martial arts
Masters Degree, I took some traditional Chinese medicine courses. I studied
the channel theory, electroencephalography and tested methods using channels.
This was helpful for writing my thesis. This is how I stepped into the
traditional Chinese medicine discipline.
宇新：中醫它完全是靠您那個武術的基礎。比如說是經絡在身體里邊的走向啊，和
這個有關系嗎？
Yu Xin: Your traditional Chinese medicine skills rely on your martial arts
foundation. For example the direction of the energy channels in oneós body,
does it relate to this?
李有甫：有關係。因為武術啊，中醫和氣功，其實它就是不分家的。都是中華傳統
文化，同根同源。
Li Youfu: Yes, they are related. Martial arts, traditional Chinese medicine
and Qigong belong to the same family and work in conjunction with each other.
They are all part of the traditional Chinese culture, and they have the
same fundamental root.
宇新：噢，它們有這樣的密切的聯繫。就說您在中醫領域還有很多治病的這樣的神
奇的故事？
Yu Xin: Oh, you are saying that these disciplines are closely linked? That
leads me to the assumption that you can tell many miraculous stories about
curing illnesses with traditional Chinese medicine?
李有甫：是。後來因為我也讀了中醫碩士。最後才讀的中醫博士，拿到中醫博士學
位。
Li Youfu: Yes. I also was awarded a traditional Chinese medicine Masters
Degree. I continued my studies until I graduated with a traditional Chinese
medicine Ph.D.
宇新：噢，中醫博士學位。
Yu Xin: Oh, a traditional Chinese medicine Ph.D.?
李有甫：那是我在實踐當中，我這個人就是一面自學，一面實踐，一面就去拿學位
吧。
Li Youfu: Actually, I continued my self-study, put it into practice and
obtained the degree at the same time.
宇新：李有甫先生真是不簡單啊。那麼您跟我們分享一下您在中醫這個領域，治病
的一些這樣的例子好嗎？
Yuxin: Mr. Li Youfu, you are so remarkable. Given all you have achieved,
could you share some examples about treating illness through traditional
Chinese medical science?
李有甫：按照中醫的理論，用一個扶正祛邪，就是幫助人體的自身的來抗病的能力，
不是要過多的去依靠這個藥物啊，外界的東西。所以呢，提高人的所謂說他抵抗能
力，這是很重要的。那時候，我去俄國，被請去來講學，在俄國科學院中醫中心，
當時一個四歲的小女孩吧，她患的血液病，是白血病，她當時就找到我，當時我正
在給人用中醫看病。這小孩也不能扎針哪，我一看瘦得像個小貓似的。雖然很好看
一個小孩，但是一點都沒有精神，因為很厲害那個病。她測試血液，經過檢查的時
候呢，一共有20項指標，18項不正常，只有2項是正常的。所以這個很危險。
Li Youfu: Traditional Chinese medical science theory calls for righteousness
and requires dispelling the evil. This means, improving a human bodyós ability
to fight illness. One does not rely too much on medicine, anything external.
What Ióm saying here is that it is very important to gain a healthy body,
so one can resist illness. At that time, I was invited to Russia to lecture
at the Traditional Chinese Medical Science Center of the Russian Science
Institute. There was a four-year-old girl, who had leukemia, a cancer that
damages the bodyós blood cell producing ability. She came to see me when
I was treating patients with traditional Chinese medicine. This little child
had not been treated with the acupuncture technique. She was emaciated. Though
she was very good-looking, she had no energy, as her illness was in an advanced
stage. She had her blood tested, and the results showed that out of twenty
test results eighteen were abnormal. Only two of the test results turned
out normal. Her health condition was life threatening.
宇新：對啊，病入膏肓
Yuxin: Yes, her disease was beyond cure.
。
李有甫：她說醫生說沒有辦法治了。問我有辦法沒有？我說試試吧。我想能夠幫助
她。那麼我就給她用耳穴。用一種中藥仔來壓在耳朵上的不同的穴位。我給她治療
了兩個月以後，她化驗血液啊，有18項正常，2項不正常。
Li Youfu: She shared that the doctors had said that there was no cure for
her condition. She asked me whether I could cure her. I said I could try.
I thought that I could help her. So I used the ear acupuncture on her. I
used a kind of traditional Chinese medicine seed and applied it to the different
acupoints of her ears. I treated her for two months. When she had her blood
tested again, there were eighteen items normal and only two were abnormal.
宇新：反過來了。
Yuxin: It turned out to be the opposite.
李有甫：反過來了。再治了半個多月以後，兩個半月的時候再一化驗，全部都正常。
然後她繼續鞏固治療了一段時間，她家里人非常高興。這小孩也就變化了，氣色很
好，小孩越來越好看了，也很健康。
Li Youfu: Yes, the opposite. After another two weeks of treatment and after
a total of two and a half months of treatments she had returned to health.
The last testing showed no abnormalities. She continued with the treatment
for a while and her family was very happy. This little child had returned
to health and her complexion kept improving, She had gained back her physical
health.
宇新：噢，用耳針？
Yuxin: Well, you used ear acupuncture? The result was achieved through ear
acupuncture?
李有甫：這是中醫治病的方法。
Li Youfu: That is a traditional Chinese treatment method.
宇新：那除了這個耳針、針灸，還有用什麼樣的方法呢？
Yuxin: Besides ear acupuncture and needle acupuncture, what other methods
did you use?
李有甫：用中藥。
Li Youfu: I used traditional Chinese medicine.
宇新：中醫、中藥。
Yuxin: You employ traditional Chinese medical science and traditional Chinese
medicine?
李有甫：後來呢，就是我到了美國之後。一對夫婦，他們想要小孩，各種方法都沒
有。最後他們就找到我說：你看看，中醫能不能幫助？我說那就調理身體吧。我就
覺得母親哪，她的身體就像土壤一樣，土壤都肥沃正常，陽光什麼都有了，它就能
產生植物和花草。那麼我給她調整一段時間之後呢，他們有了小寶寶了，小男孩，
非常漂亮。
Li Youfu: After I immigrated to the United States, I treated a couple that
wanted to have children. Although they had tried everything possible, they
still could not have a child. Finally they came to me. They wanted to see
whether traditional Chinese medicine would help? I suggested that she first
return to physical health. I thought that a motherós body is just like soil.
When the soil is fertile and normal, is exposed to sunshine and nutrients,
it can produce plants and flowers. After I treated her for a while they
had a baby, a baby boy that was very cute.
宇新：噢，這是什麼時候的事情呢？
Yuxin: Well, when did this happen?
李有甫：這是前幾年吧，在美國的事情。
Li Youfu: That is several years ago, in the United States.
宇新：在美國。
Yuxin: In the United States?
李有甫：還有一個就是，一個美國人，他找我治腰痛。我給他看、把脈的時候呢，
我說你的肝很不好了。我就給他用中藥方啊，就是舒肝理氣的方法吧，因為他的壓
力太大。緩解他的壓力，讓他養心安神，另外我也給他一點針灸。後來啊，他就好
了。最後他跟我講，他說我的肝哪，西醫檢查之後說是要換肝的，說這個肝不能用
了，不能工作了，要換一個肝。那現在他檢查之後說不用換肝了。
Li Youfu: I will share one more story. An American asked me to treat his
lower back pain. During treatment and checking his pulse, I told him that
you have severe liver problems. I prescribed a traditional Chinese medicine
which properties relaxed his liver and Qi, since there was great pressure
in that area. He needed to relieve this pressure, so I prescribed rest to
help him become tranquil. I also applied acupuncture. He too recovered.
Finally, he told me that he was told by doctors practicing western medicine
that his liver had failed and he needed a liver transplant. After my treatments
he went for a physical check-up. He was told that that he no longer needed
a liver transplant.
宇新：您是真是不簡單。象您那個前面說您非常喜歡點穴嘛，而且您也學到了這樣
一個點穴，名師也教過您點穴的這個方法。在醫學上，在您的這個治療的過程當中
有沒有用上過？
Yuxin: You are truly remarkable. You just mentioned that you treat by touching
the acupuncture points and that you also are proficient in acupuncture treatments.
Your famous teacher also taught you how to treat with the acupuncture technique?
When you treated patients, did you use it?
李有甫：點穴呢，我是用它救過一次人。過去在北京，那時候為了研究氣功，說有
一個人哪，病得很嚴重。這個人呢，就是腿被碰傷了，碰了以後骨頭也沒有斷，碰
了以後呢他不能走路了，全身不能動。用那小車把他拉來了，然後把他抬到床上給
我看。我一看呢，我說這個人是閉了他的經絡了，經絡給阻斷，他就不能動了。那
麼我看這個已經好幾天了，也挺嚴重的了。我就用解穴的方法，他是腿傷嗎，他去
上山打獵被碰到腿了。我就給他解穴。唉，他然後下地走路，當時走回去了，可以
走，還可以跳。
Li Youfu: I once it used to save someone by touching the acupuncture points.
It was in Beijing, where we were doing qigong research. We had a patient
who was very sick. This personós legs were injured, but there were no broken
bones. He was paralyzed. They brought him and asked me to have a look. After
examining him I found that this personós meridians were blocked. Thatós
why he couldnót move. This condition had existed for several days and he
was in serious condition. I used the method that unblocked his acupuncture
points. His legs were injured. He had gong hunting in the mountains and
hurt his legs. So I unblocked his acupuncture points. Well, he then could
walk and he walked home right away. He could walk and jump as well.
宇新：一看就知道他是穴位被閉塞掉了。
Yuxin: So, after looking at him you knew that his acupuncture points were
blocked.
李有甫：被閉塞掉了。唉，穴位一閉住，他就不能走路了。所以中醫啊，點穴這些
很神奇的。
Li Youfu: Yes, they were blocked. Once the acupuncture points were blocked
he could no longer walk. In traditional Chinese medical science, the touching
of the acupuncture points result in miracles.
宇新：還有什麼神奇的故事？
Yuxin: Any other such miraculous stories?
李有甫：我這還有一個病例啊，就是在美國有那么一個華人的一個牧師，他才58歲。
平時身体挺好，突然中風，直接送到洛杉磯的凱撒醫院，那個醫院在好萊塢那里，
它還是腦外科挺著名的一個醫院。送去之后，醫生搶救不過來了，說沒有辦法了。
就加護病房里，說准備后事。就要把拔掉維生系統的呼吸器，各種管子拔掉了。
Li Youfu: One of my patients, a Chinese pastor, 58 years-old, who resided
in the United States, used to be of good health. He had a stroke and was
taken to the Caesar Hospital in Los Angeles, located in Hollywood. This
hospital is very famous for performing cerebral surgery. The doctors could
not cure him and said that there was no cure. They put him in intensive care
and asked him to prepare for his funeral. Actually what they asked him that
he gave them permission to pull the life-supporting respirator, and stop
all medications and treatments that kept him alive.
宇欣：診斷是什麼病呢？
Yu: What was wrong with him?
李有甫：大面積腦出血，就是腦出血。這個時候他們家人通過一個朋友找到我，看
看我能不能幫忙，我去了一看我說盡量吧，當時要救人也顧不了很多了，就跑到加
護病房說是朋友來看他，我就給他用針灸，然後治完了我就走。
Li: He had suffered cerebral hemorrhage. His family contacted me through
a friend of mine. They asked if I could help him. I said that I could give
it a try. The situation was highly critical. I didnót have time to think
about it and went to the intensive care unit. I said that I was the patientós
friend, so they allowed me to see him. I used acupuncture. After I was done,
I left immediately.
這樣幾天之後，醫生看了說這個人可以活了，他家裡的人很感動，後來從加護病房
竟然轉到了普通病房，當時說要拔管讓他家人簽字，他太太不簽字，他的太太說：
有一線希望我也不要讓他這樣走了。到了普通病房讓我繼續給他治，當時醫院已經
同意了我給他治療，後來又好一些就轉到了護理中心，經過了很長一段時間治療後，
他很多問題都解決了，所有的管子都拿掉了，人可以坐起來可以站起來了。
A few days later, his doctor diagnosed him again and said that he was better
and his chances to survive had improved. His family was very touched. After
some time he was transferred from intensive care to a regular room. When
the doctors suggested to pull the life-support system, his wife refused
to sign the paperwork. His wife said: ǒAs long as there is some kind of chance,
I will not give up.ō After he was transferred to a regular room, I continued
with my treatments. The hospital officials did not object to my treating
him. Then, after his condition improved further, he was transferred to a
rehabilitation center. Then, after some time, his many problems disappeared,
all tubes were removed and he could sit and stand up without problem.
宇欣：哇！真的是很神奇。
Yu: Wow, thatós truly amazing!
李有甫：中醫還是很有價值的，在人體上它都能夠起到一些現代醫學所達不到的。
Li: Chinese medicine is very precious. It can achieve something that cannot
be achieved with modern science when it comes to the human body.
宇欣：李有甫先生，您的診所是在洛杉機的什麼地方呢？
Yu: Mr. Li, can you tell us the location of your clinic in Los Angles?
李有甫：在洛杉機的羅拉漢那邊。
Li: Itós at Lolahen.
宇欣：我想我們的觀眾朋友如果身體上有什麼問題，可以到李有甫的診所去尋醫問
診。
Yu: I suggest our audience go to see Mr. Li, if you have any health problems.
李有甫：謝謝大家，有什麼問題可以來商量解決。
Li: Thanks. Weóll see how we can help you.
我國歷史上的中醫大師，像華陀﹑扁鵲﹑李時珍等都是有特異功能的，他們無需採
用望、聞、問、切的手段，就能夠看出人哪裡有病？李有甫先生也是如此，他不但
有高超的治病方法，還具有神奇的遙視功能。
Yu: Chinese medicine doctors of the past, such as Hua To, Bian Que, Li Shizhen,
possessed supernatural abilities. By looking at people, they were able
to tell where peopleós diseases reside. Mr. Li possesses not only superior
healing, but also miraculous clairvoyance abilities.
主持了：除了以上這些，中醫看病的神奇的故事和例子之外，聽說您還有遙視的功
能？可以用遙視給人治病？
Yu: Besides what you just told us, the stories about using Chinese medicine
to treat illnesses, we heard that you also are clairvoyant. Do you use that
to treat illnesses?
李有甫：因為我從武術碩士畢業後在大學裡教課，後來在北京他們請我做傳統中醫
的一個研究所的研究員，那個時候我就對氣功開始進行研究，偶然的機會有人跟我
交流的時候，我們互相傳授了一些祕傳的東西，我學會了遙診。
Li: I taught at a university after graduating with a Masterós degree in
martial arts. Then, I was offered a research associate position in an institute
in Beijing. I was asked to research traditional Chinese medicine. Besides,
I also researched qigong. During chance meetings with others, we exchanged
what we had learned, things that had been passed down in secret. I learned
the tele-diagnosis.
宇欣：遙視診斷？
Yu: What is tele-diagnosis?
李有甫：遙診和遙視是兩個概念，遙診是我能夠用手掌感受到對方的疾病，一開始
是面對面的不用把脈，我的手伸出來可以感受你身體各部份的疾病。那個時候在北
京，比如社科院的民族研究所、北京世紀壇醫院﹑262醫院﹑還有清華大學的電機系，
很多地方我都做過現場的診斷，每次都幾十個人，甚至有時上百個人，我給他們經
過很長時間的診斷，都證明是準確的。
Li: It is different than teleportation. Tele-diagnosing results when I can
feel the other partyós illness through my palm. First, when we face each
other, without touching the pulse, I extend my hand towards the person.
I can feel the illnesses emanating from different parts of a body. In Beijing,
such as at the Ethnicity Research Institute, Beijing Shijitan Hospital,
262 Hospital, Motor Engineering Department of Qinghua University, and other
many places, I performed live diagnosis. There were either 10 people or
even up to 100 people. After a period of conventional diagnosis, it was
proven that my diagnosis was correct.
宇欣：這與您的武術功底有關係嗎？
Yu: Does it have anything to do with the martial arts youóve been practicing?
李有甫：有關係！後來這個發展到什麼程度？有一個收穫是我就是可以看到人的前
世。
Li: Yes, of course. Later this ability developed to other stages. For example,
I could see a personós prior life.
宇欣：我想這個話題觀眾朋友看了也是很感興趣。
Yu: I think our audience is interested in this topic as well.
李有甫：那是怎麼回事呢？當時大家知道，中國人體科學學會的錢學森先生他為了
研究人體的特異功能，就成立了這個研究會。研究會下屬有一個人體科學研究中心，
這個中心當時聘請我做副研究員，也是偶然的。
Li: Well., to explore humanós supernormal abilities, Mr. Qian Xuesen from
the China Human Body Scientific Research Association founded this research
association. There was a Human Body Scientific Research Institute affiliated
with this research association, where I was hired as a research associate.
我是為了研究這個東西，我找了一些人，我自己主動看了一些人，他們沒有看過，
我看這些人的前世是什麼樣，然後我再讓他們看，我不講，結果他們的答案和我所
看的答案是一樣的。我沒有講，這還不是一個、兩個。
To carry out my research, I invited some people who had the supernormal
ability of teleportation. I began to us my supernormal abilities on some
people. I saw scenes from their previous lives. Then I asked them to also
view the peopleós prior lives. Without sharing with them what I had seen,
the answers they provided agreed with what I had seen. This happened quite
frequently.
後來我進一步證實，斷定人確實有輪迴有前世今生，那麼我也沒有跟人家說，我想，
這個話如果人講出來的話，炫燿自己功能的話，他可以騙別人，但是我不能騙自己，
我自己知道，我有這個認識，我覺得它是真實的，所以我產生什麼樣的想法呢？我
要去探索，人為什麼來到人世？為什麼還有前世？這個對我觸動很大，這就是我的
出發點，後來就想修煉，就從這裡開始。
I found out that reincarnation truly happen, but I didnót share my findings
with anyone else. I thought, if this were to be revealed by someone, for
the sake of showing off oneós supernormal ability, one could use this ability
to the disadvantage of others. I couldnót get involved in that. I am sure
I have this ability. So, I thought of some things that would be good to know.
I wanted to find out why people come to this world? Why do we have previous
lives? It shocked me. This was my starting point. Later I began to cultivate,
this is where it got started.
宇欣：你講到了你也具備這樣的一個能看到人的前世今生的，這也就是後來逐漸發
現自己具備這樣的一個功能，這都是與您前期的整個的武術功底都是有關的。
Yu: You were mentioning that you are able to see peopleós past and current
lives, and this ability had arisen from your martial arts abilities.
李有甫：有關係。
Li: Yes, this is related.
然而就是這樣一位聲譽極高的武林醫師，卻也有自己的煩惱。武術練的越高功能出
的越多，功能出的越多越有解不開的謎底。於是他苦苦尋找人生的答案，
However, even a prestigious martial arts master worries. As his martial
arts level rises, his supernormal abilities materialize. The more such abilities
emerged, the more questions come to mind. Therefore, he was trying to look
for the answers why life exists.
宇欣：當你發現自己有這樣的功能的時候，你就覺得說要問一個為什麼，人最深層
的東西到底是什麼？
Yu: When you realized that you had supernormal ability, you began to look
for a why, whatós the deepest thing about a human?
李有甫：是的。
Li: Right
宇欣：人的前世今生到底是為什麼？你的這些外在的武術都具備了，你想找一個更
深層的原因，就是剛才您說的，我就想修煉了，說到修煉這個話題呢，就有新的話
題又出來了。
Yu: Why human has past lives? You are accomplished in martial arts. You
were just looking for a deeper reason, as you just said, I want to cultivate,
which brings up a new topic.
李有甫先生，您是這樣一個赫赫有名的武術界中醫界，這樣一個知名的人物，當您
這個功成名就，可以說，成為一個聞名遐邇的大師級人物的時候，為什麼您又放棄
了原來有的這樣一切，而從新當起了一個氣功的弟子，一個普通的學員。
Mr. Li, you are such a well-known person in either martial arts or Chinese
medicine circles. You are such a famous person. After you became a famous
person, a popular master in either field, how come you decided to give up
all worldly goods and chose to start from scratch and become a qigong disciple?ō
李有甫：通過遙診，我知道這個物質，唯物論所侷限的這個物質觀念是沒法解釋，
所以我就想，我能不能夠進一步的研究它，那麼後來我已經是山西大學的武術的副
教授，我也做了北京的中醫研究所的研究員。
Li: Through Tele-diagnosis, I came to realize that the substance, the substance
defined by human thought can’t explain many phenomena. Therefore, I thought
doing some further research would bring answers. So, I became an Associate
Professor of Martial Arts at Shanxi University and associate researcher
at the Beijing Chinese Medicine Institute.
那後來我出國，又來到美國，來到美國之後，我就想從佛教和宗教裡邊來探索這些
個奧妙，佛經讀了也不少，道書也讀了很多，我修煉的方法也試了很多，也吃了很
多苦，但是這個也不行，找了很多的大師去了解，他們說什麼，而且大部分宗教裡
的人，對錢比較感興趣，真正傳授修煉的東西，幾乎沒有。
Then, I went abroad. I immigrated to the United States. After I came here,
I wanted to find answers to what confused me about Buddhism or Daoism. Ióve
read many Buddhist scriptures, also Taoist works, I had tried many different
ways of cultivation, and I had also endured lots of hardships, but I still
came up empty handed. I listened to many Masters. In addition, many people
working in religions are keen on money, as they lacked the true essence of
a cultivator.
宇欣：你去找其他的這些老師去問，去問這些名師，有沒有感覺說，他不知道為什
麼，理論方面的東西沒有？
Yu: When you went to look for these Master, to ask those famous Masters,
have you felt that for some reason, they are missing the theory part?
李有甫：對。
Li: Yes
宇欣：這是為什麼？
Yu: Why?
李有甫：沒法解釋，就是各個宗教，甚至西方的宗教我都在研究了解，就探索了之
後，回來很苦惱，因為為什麼找不到方法，在1996年的5月份，有一個偶然的機會下，
使我感到柳暗花明，當時有一個歌唱家，您知道，就是中國大陸的關貴敏先生，他
來美國演出，他演出登了報紙，還有他的電話，我一看，因為他在北京的時候，我
們那時候研究人體科學的時候，研究氣功的時候，他就是我的好朋友，我就打電話
給他，我就找到他，跟他聊天。
Li: Itós hard to explain, I was looking into each religion, even western
religions. After I finished my studies, I became very worried, because I
had no way of finding a true Master. In May 1996, by coincidence, I had
the opportunity to come closer to my goal. At that time, there was a singer
— Mr. Guan Guimin from Mainland China. He came to the US to perform, and
he advertised in the newspaper. He also gave out his phone number. When
he was in Beijing, at that time I was doing human body scientific research
and research on qigong and as he was my good friend, I called him. We met
and had a good chat.
他知道我也喜歡這方面，修煉的東西，我就給他講我這個在美國這麼多年的這個尋
求，他說，你不用找了，他說，就是看《轉法輪》，直接了當的給我談了法輪功，
我就很想看這本書，後來，終於拿到了《轉法輪》，我一口氣就讀，連續的讀下來。
He understood that I was very interested in cultivation. Then I told him
that my long-term goal was to emigrate from China to the United States.
He told me, ǒYou can stop searching any further.ō He continued, ǒI just
read Zhuan Falun. He talked to me about Falun Gong openly. I wanted to read
this book. Later, I found a copy of Zhuan Falun. I read it read through the
entire book without stopping.
我也就發現，我所要得到的答案，這個全有了，為什麼有人會轉世，為什麼物質概
念不是原來那樣，為什麼人會有遙視，有這個療診的功能，這些事情，所有內斂的
東西，包括武術，內家氣功，所有修煉的方法，他不但講出來了，而且講的比這個
高的多。
Then I discovered that every answer I was looking for was discussed in this
book, such as why people reincarnate, why the concept of matter is completely
different than before, why people possess the ability of clairvoyance or
Tele-Diagnosis, and other such matters. Everything related to internal cultivation,
such as martial arts and internal qigong practice. This book not only told
me about this cultivation method but also was also spoke of very high-level
things.
為什麼人他能夠通周天？能夠有功能，能夠修煉，甚至有輪迴這些事情，人應該怎
麼樣，宗教裡是怎麼一回事，他全都寫了。
The book covers all subjects asked by humans. How come humans can have a
heavenly circuit, humans can have abilities, cultivate, even things such
as reincarnation, how should people live, whatós going on in religions,
and more.
人要看什麼東西，別人要告訴你真正的東西，就想把寶物給你了，那你學的人呢，
必須抱著一顆誠心。我看了以後感動得流淚，我一直在想：哎呀，我的人生解決了！
我要得到的東西，我要明白的道理全在裡面，而且遠遠超過了我所想像的我要得到
的東西。對於他講的宇宙的奧妙、人生的奧妙全在裡面，所以我決定開始修煉法輪
功。
When others tell you the truth, they are giving you something precious.
As to the person who wants to learn, must learn it with a sincere heart.
After I read the book, I was moved to tears. I kept thinking: Wow, my life
is settled! The thing I want to obtain, the theory that I want to understand
is all included in it. It also exceeds things that I can imagine and want
to obtain. The mystery of the universe, mystery of human lives are all included
in it, therefore, I decided to start practicing Falun Gong right away.
宇欣：您突然之間就是接觸到法輪功的這樣一本書，您就覺得這就是我要找到的？
Yu: So suddenly you found a Falun Gong book, and you feel that this is what
you are looking for, correct?
李有甫：是。
Li: Yes
宇欣：那有些人還是非常不解。
Yu: But there are some people who donót understand it at all.
李有甫：當時我已經48歲，我已經是教過國內外五十幾所大學的教授。而且我看什
麼書，我講一句老實話，也不是不謙虛，我一定要讀懂他，一定要明白其中的道理，
我煉什麼功，我就一定要按照老師的要求去煉，讓老師（師父）滿意。我不能欺騙
自己，那麼我要明白的就是人生、宇宙到底是什麼，所以我看了《轉法輪》之後，
我想做個徒弟能夠格嗎？真的，我就想只要我能看這本書，真的去理解，就非常好
了。
Li: At that time, I was 48 years old, I taught as a professor in over 50
universities at home and abroad. Therefore, no matter what I read, to be
honest with you, not because I am not being humble enough, I understand
all that is said. I understand the connotation and what the book is telling
us. No matter what, I will cultivate, I must follow Teacherós requirements
and hope that Teacher is accepting me into the practice. I canót cheat myself?
Then what Ióm trying to understand is what is human life and the universe.
After I read Zhuan Falun, I was wondering if Ióm qualified to be a disciple.
Indeed, I think that as long as I keep reading this book and truly come
to understand everything, the results should be good.
宇欣：那您就毅然決然的說我要修煉法輪功了，你要當法輪功的弟子？
Yu: Then have you quickly decided to start practicing Falun Gong, and become
a Falun Gong practitioner?
李有甫：是的，我要作法輪功弟子。
Li: Yes, I want to be a Falun Gong practitioner.
宇欣：重新做起，那您以前練的這些武術都怎麼辦？
Yu: You had to start all over, then how do you deal with the martial arts
that youód been practicing before?
李有甫：練的武術，是呀，我一開始還不知道，覺得太極拳我可以繼續練哪，八卦
樁我可以站哪，可以走啊，可以繼續一天幾個小時的練，我覺得很舒服。後來不行
了，就說一煉功就得有一個「不二法門」的問題，你必須得專一。是啊，我原來練
這些東西我很專哪，別的東西沒有去練亂七八糟的。後來我看到師父講的「不二法
門」就是說不能兩個同時修，因為那也是一種修煉，只不過層次不一樣。
Li: Martial Arts I practiced before. Yes, in the beginning I didnót understand
what it meant to practice Falun Gong. I thought that I could still practice
Taichi or the Bagua standing exercise. After a few hoursó practice, I felt
very comfortable. Later I realized there was an issue my continuing with
other practices, because as soon as you start practicing, there is an issue
of ǒNo Second Cultivation Way.ō You must be dedicated to one way. Thatós
right, the martial arts that I practiced before I was dedicated to them,
I didnót practice other things at the same time. Later I read what Teacher
lectured about ǒNo Second Cultivation Way.ō This means that one can’t cultivate
in two schools at the same time, because the other school is also a cultivation
way. The difference is that the two are at different levels.
宇欣：那您怎麼辦？
Yu: Then what did you do?
李有甫：我就要修法輪功。
Li: Ióm determined to practice Falun Gong.
宇欣：是不是以前這些你就都放下了，不練了？
Yu: Then, what you practiced before you gave up, and no longer practiced
them?
李有甫：都放下了，我都放下不練了。
Li: Yes, I did, I donót practicing them any more.
宇欣：您用無數的汗水和心血辛苦換來的，這所有的說放下就輕易的放下，我不練
了，我現在就要練法輪功了﹖
Yu: Are you saying that all your fame and profit, everything that you gained
through painstaking efforts, everything, I mean you let go of everything
so easily. You decided, I wonót do it any longer; I just want to practice
Falun Gong.
李有甫：「朝聞道，夕可死矣」，而且得到這本書之後，我的想法就是我只要能看
這本書，繼續修下去，去讀我能夠理解，就非常好了。而且還有五套功法可以煉，
還可以指導怎麼做，而且老師甚至可以來美國講法，我可以當面問師父什麼問題。
Li: There is a proverb, ǒWhen a person hears the Dao in the morning, he
is willing to die in the evening.ō After I found this book, my thought was,
“as long as I can continue reading this book, continue with my cultivation
and understand what is said in the book, it is very good." Plus we have
five sets of exercises; there are instructions on how to do them. Teacher
even came to the US to lecture. I could raise my questions to my Teacher.
他當面給我回答，而且出乎我們任何想像，因為他回答的你再一想，哇，這個道理
原來是在我們殼的外面，在我們人類認知的能力之外。所以我不遺憾，放下任何東
西都不遺憾。
He answered my question in person. His answers are completely beyond our
imagination. Because after you take a second thought about his answers,
you go, ǒWow, this answer is beyond us, beyond our human recognition. Therefore
I have no regrets, for giving up anything. I have no regrets at all.
宇欣：從您的口中說出來，我想真的得要好好的思考一下。
我還是有一個問題，您剛才說您見到您的師父，從師父口中親自回答了您的問題，
您覺得非常的榮幸，非常的不得了。可是您以前是單傳弟子，您的兩位老師都是密
傳您、單傳您，您以前不曾有過這樣的感受嗎？
Yu: Listening to you, I think we really need to give it a serious thought.
I have another question, you were saying just now that you have seen your
Teacher, and your Teacher answered your questions, made you feel very proud,
very honored. However, before you were the only disciple and both of your
Masters passed to you their knowledge in secret. Yet, have you ever had this
kind of feelings before?
李有甫：這個陳盛甫老師他是純的儒家思想，那麼第二位老師陳濟生老師他道家的
思想，我知道那些是武功、武術，甚至有涉及到一些道家的東西。但是人生是
要修煉，要得到解脫，明白人生的道理是件大事，法輪大法是佛家的，今生就矣
了，能修這個大法我無遺憾了。
Li: One of my teachers Chen Shengbu was practicing the pure Confucianism.
My second teacher Chen Jisheng was practicing Daoism. What I know is that
they practice the martial arts, so they covered a small portion of Daoism.
However, the ultimate goal for a personós life is to cultivate, to gain
elevation and to understand the theory of life. This is precious. Falun Dafa
is a Buddha Fa. By being able to cultivate in Dafa, I no longer need to
search ǔ I am content!
宇欣：我想請問您，現在法輪功在中國遭到迫害，很多的法輪功學員他們都要到街
上去講真相、發真相資料，那您怎麼辦？
Yu: Then Iód like to ask you. Falun Gong is persecuted. Many Falun Gong
practitioners clarify the truth and hand out flyers on the streets and other
places. What are you doing?
李有甫：我也去呀，我也要這樣做！
Li: Same here.
宇欣：您能夠放下自己的身價，這樣做確實不簡單。
Yu: Itós such a great deal for you to be able to let go your fame and do
this.
李有甫：江澤民為首的這個邪黨，它們對法輪功這樣殘酷的迫害鎮壓，其實他們是
幹了一件最愚蠢的事情，為什麼呢？如果中國人都煉法輪功，中國會非常的美好。
你不管誰領導、誰統治，整個社會是一個美好的社會。
Li: The evil CCP (Chinese Communist Party) led by Jiang Zemin persecutes
Falun Gong in such a cruel way. They have done the stupidest thing. Why?
If Chinese people were all to practice Falun Gong, China would become much
better, no matter who runs the country, the society would have been a wonderful
society.
宇欣：為什麼？
Yu: Why?
李有甫：因為人都做好人了，法輪功修的就是真善忍，就是讓人做好人。
Li: Because everyone would become a good person. Falun Gong cultivates ǒTruth,
Compassion, Forbearance,ō which is to teach people to be good.
宇欣：李有甫先生一個響噹噹的大師級人物，放下以前所練的這一切，確實是值得
我們深思。李有甫先生的故事到此就先告一段落。
Yu: Mr. Li Youfu, you are such a great person, being able to quit everything
you practiced before, this is truly worth our giving it a serious thought!
Weóll wrap up now with Mr. Liós story.
李有甫：好的，謝謝！
Li: Thanks.
宇欣：聽了李有甫先生的這一番經歷故事之後，我想我們是不是也不應該再為蠅頭
小利而患得患失了呢？節目時間到了，非常感謝您收看今天的節目，下次節目時間
我們再見！
Yu: After we heard Mr. Liós story, should we think about whether we should
still worry about petty gain and loss? Time is up for our todayós program.
We truly appreciated your time; weóll see you next time!